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zico 1:16 Wed Jan 1
Scouting?

Anyone on here know the details of the scouting network (if you can call it that!) at West Ham? How many scouts, where are they based, links, connections that sort of thing?

I just find it baffling how back in the 70's and 80's West Ham could unearth talent like the Devonshire's, McAvennies and Wards without the resources you have now but these days our recruitment seems to be off the cuff and a gamble seemingly with every player we sign?

A good pair of eyes was all you needed according to Ron Greenwood and at West Ham the likes of Wally St Pier and Eddie Baily spotted plenty of talent. John Lyall had players watched several times and I believe went to see players himself regularly before signing them. Backgrounds and personality were looked into and phone calls were made to other Managers and confidants to gain advice about certain players.

Obviously I haven't got rose tinted specs on and accept that a lot of dross passed through the Club as well and realise today that you can't cherry pick the best youngsters from around East London anymore, times have changed, but with all the stats, spreadsheets and computer programs football seems to be based on these days I wonder if the basic fundamentals, like "can he play and does he run around a bit" seem to have been long forgotten?

Pickle Rick 10:58 Fri Jan 3
Re: Scouting?

You didn't really have interfering Chairpersons back then, they let the scouts and manager get on with what they were paying them to do.

blueeyed.handsomeman 4:29 Fri Jan 3
Re: Scouting?

Arsenal man set to be DIRECTOR OF FOOTBALL which incorporates the role of CHIEF SCOUT.

the surname is Rowley

Alex V 6:26 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

What we've seen at the club over the past decade is the 'old ways' in operation.

Unless the club modernises it will be doomed.

istabraq 6:01 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Go back to the old ways.eyes on the ground watching games.get rid of all this stats and gps tracking.can he fucking play yes or no.

chiff 4:52 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Totally agree, thanks Don.

Side of Ham 4:51 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Isn't as simple as taking Brentfords DoF though is it, Brentford can negotiate on being Brentford with limited funds, he comes to West Ham and all of a sudden he's getting quoted silly money for these punts he's made previously for Brentford.

Don Ravioli 4:46 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Chiff 4:27
I think most of the decent young players at school level have already been picked up by clubs.
Chelsea have summer academies/ schools all over Essex.
Anyone that looks half decent they can then pick up very early.
West Ham should be doing the same but as you know that requires forward thinking and money. Two things our lot can’t or won’t do.

Leeshere 4:42 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

We probably just use YouTube, Big Sam liked his video analysis.

goose 4:30 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Brentford are an excellent example. If Sullivan had half a brain he’d snap up their DoF and scouting team/system.
It’ll pay back the cost in a year or two.

chiff 4:27 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

A recent article I read about WHU suggested that in recent years we have adopted a poor system of scouting for youth tallent compared to other similar clubs and even compared to championship clubs.
However, I met a retired teacher in the summer and we were talking about this very subject and he told me that in the sixties and seventies in London scouts would often come to watch school football, but in the latter part of his career scouts were nonexistent.
I do feel that tallent is not being spotted these days. Moreover I feel that there seems to be no attempts to nurture potential tallent as it is easier to look abroad.
Finally I will acknowledge I have no first hand experience of these matters and could be wrong.

I could be wrong.

Bernie 4:25 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

We signed Marco Boogers off a video.

Probably should've taken the time to send a human being to watch him

terry-h 4:00 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Brentford are so well run,that not only are they building their own ground for the start of next season,their scouting system is so good,they invariably sell two or three players per season at a profit, and manage to replace sold players with even better recruits.

Alex V 3:47 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

>>> Thing is though Alex it doesn't need technical scouting and analytics to work out how much running a player does, can he pass, dribble, tackle, shoot. How many passes does he make and how many go forward. What's he like when the chips are down. What's his tracking back like and is he fit, is he consistent.

This is exactly what technical scouting can provide. Agreed you then need some level of checking from scouts, to know character and give second opinions etc.

>>> If you had a player watched 10 times before you buy you could probably work most of the above out within 6 or 7 games.

On video you can watch 50. You can assess every touch a player has ever made. This idea that some ex-pro goes to a game and scribbles down these things accurately is archaic to me. There's a place for scouting, but technology has phased out most of the traditional process, simply because it's massively efficient in comparison.

ChesterRd 3:38 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

You should use all the resources and tools available not just rely on one, I think character and maintaining a professional lifestyle are important, how is that quantified by stats.

These owners have been running football clubs 25 years. Their MO was most probably out of date to start with, it certainly is now.

As for scouting at West Ham under the current board, predominantly Silkman and the Mckays.

Add in Sullivan thinking he is a genius negotiator and it's little wonder it's a mess

The millions Sullivan has wasted trying to be cheap is incredible, he is the epitome of penny wise pound foolish.

zico 3:08 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Thing is though Alex it doesn't need technical scouting and analytics to work out how much running a player does, can he pass, dribble, tackle, shoot. How many passes does he make and how many go forward. What's he like when the chips are down. What's his tracking back like and is he fit, is he consistent.

Hardly rocket science. If you had a player watched 10 times before you buy you could probably work most of the above out within 6 or 7 games. Half of the people on here could tell you when we buy a player he will be shit or will be injury prone. I mean I am sure a very low percentage on WHO probably thought signing Wilshire wasn't a risk!!!!

istabraq 3:07 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

All nearly done now by agents .we dont have anybody in wales ireland northern ireland scotland for example or the north east.manager needs to have his own people scouting and the same at academy level.cole carrick rice noble tomkins etc all brought in by a pair of eyes trusted by hampson and tindall at academy level.now its all foreign youngsters sent in by agents.ironic is that when we had a european scout years ago for underage he recommended pogba at 16 but club wouldnt pay the money and I dont think we ever signed any youngster from abroad when we had that scout.just lije seniors now we want the cheap option.

Alex V 3:00 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

Not sure how unusual we are in terms of numbers of scouts. But certainly we seem a long way behind when it comes to technical scouting done at base - I think these days you only need scouts to check senior targets the analytics have highlighted.

But neither matter if the results of that process are ignored anyway, eg with Fornals or Roberto who the staff had simply worked with before at other clubs. Liverpool are the hottest team in the world right now because Klopp was clever enough to actually listen to his technical scouts!

zico 2:48 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

I'm quite staggered. In my naivety I really thought at the very least you would have several in different areas of the country and a few in Europe. So annoying when you hear about old West Ham players scouting for other Clubs.

goose 2:29 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

It’s embarrassing but in no way surprising.

Sven Roeder 2:26 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

I think its fairly obvious all our football related structures are amateurish and pre-historic.
Totally typical of the penny wise pound foolish antics of the clowns in charge.
A club of our size lives and dies by finding cheaper younger hungry players.
I understood when Moyes was last here he talked about all the things that needed improvement.
Obviously nothing has changed

blueeyed.handsomeman 2:21 Wed Jan 1
Re: Scouting?

it is far worse than you realise

we get to look at those who have been scouted by arsenal and a few other clubs.

but a lot of scouting for us is just recommendations by the players agents.

of course each manager has his own set of contacts

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